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15 June 2007 @ 11:53 am
Meta rec: Lee, heroism and sacrifice  
*fly-by reccing*

It's been a good week for Lee meta! brokenmnemonic has written a two-part essay on two of my favourite topics: Lee Adama and heroism. Fantastic read! Links:
- Part One
- Part Two.
 
 
Current Location: work (sadly)
Current Mood: happyhappy
 
 
 
jude_judith82: Lee Adamajude_judith82 on June 15th, 2007 04:00 am (UTC)
I love me some Lee meta. I'm going to definitely read this when I have more time. Thanks again for the rec!
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Leebop_radar on June 15th, 2007 04:21 am (UTC)
It's long but definitely worth it. *g*
brokenmnemonic: Jeff!brokenmnemonic on June 15th, 2007 01:38 pm (UTC)
I've been pimped? *bounces* Thank you :D
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Lex golden fieldbop_radar on June 16th, 2007 11:11 am (UTC)
Of course! *g* (And I have ten million comments of yours to reply to--do we really have THAT many conversations running? *stares at inbox in shock*)
brokenmnemonic: Paganbrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 11:16 am (UTC)
I think we have even more than that... I've still got 28 unanswered comments in my LJ message list, and that's just scary...
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: bsg kara eeek!bop_radar on June 16th, 2007 11:17 am (UTC)
O.O They're not ALL from me, surely!? *denial*
brokenmnemonic: Peekbrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 11:19 am (UTC)
Hmm, no, you're right, they're not all from you. I think I'm down to the last 20 or so from you to answer...
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Aishwarya Raibop_radar on June 16th, 2007 11:22 am (UTC)


Oh, well, that's ok then... *quietly dies of embarrassment*
brokenmnemonic: Amusedbrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 11:28 am (UTC)
Heheheh :D You're now officially the second most prolific poster on my LJ, and well ahead of most other people. It's Lee that does it, we should blame him ;)
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Kara/Lee lolbop_radar on June 16th, 2007 11:33 am (UTC)
Only second? *pouts* :-p

I blame Lee. *nods* I added up the comments from you in my inbox and got to 51. *iz ded* I have no clue how I will ever get on top of them! Did the two most verbose people on LJ just become friends? Seems like it!
brokenmnemonic: Amusedbrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 11:39 am (UTC)
Only second... but not by a lot ;)

51? Hmm... that's probably about right, I had seventy something comments when I started answering 24 hours ago ;)

I think you're right. It's odd that I talk to little in fandom these days, but am still spending huge amounts of time talking Lee at least within my own LJ ;)

Hmm... you've even got me writing non-depressing meta again...
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Faith smugbop_radar on June 16th, 2007 11:44 am (UTC)
Oh, make that 56! I found 5 more buried down my inbox a bit. *G*

you've even got me writing non-depressing meta again...
That is GREAT! See what a good influence I am! ;-p
brokenmnemonic: Dead but prettybrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 11:50 am (UTC)
More to go yet ;) I'm sure I can hit 60 if I work hard before lunch...

I'm giving serious thought to Kara meta this afternoon. The whole issue of her perspective on the algae planet is eating at me, in part because I don't think some Kara fangirls ask themselves if what they want for her is perhaps what she wants...

Although your old friend Hugh Laurie is distracting me by being amusing as Jeeves ;)
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Lollie yogabop_radar on June 16th, 2007 12:00 pm (UTC)
I don't think some Kara fangirls ask themselves if what they want for her is perhaps what she wants.
Mmm, that is a VERY good question! I had the opportunity to speak to supacat (my Kara girl!) properly for the first time in weeks today, and asked her her thoughts on Katee's recent comments. The ensuing conversation was (as always) enlightening, if emotionally strenuous. I'm still digesting what she had to say, but it was great to reconnect with my 'other half'. ;-)

your old friend Hugh Laurie is distracting me by being amusing as Jeeves
Awww, that series is so terribly charming! I went through a big Wodehouse phase when I was younger so I enjoy it a lot.
brokenmnemonic: Amusedbrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 12:06 pm (UTC)
Hmm... when you've digested, you're going to have to share those comments or at least your interpretations of them, I think. The world needs to know. And I'm nosy ;)

And it's good that you're reconnecting big style :D Did you get to talk over Jamie's comments as well?

Awww, that series is so terribly charming! I went through a big Wodehouse phase when I was younger so I enjoy it a lot.
He's such a twit in the show... it's a superb series, and I love the way Fry and Laurie work together. Wodehouse rocks :D
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Lex mysterybop_radar on June 16th, 2007 12:36 pm (UTC)
you're going to have to share those comments or at least your interpretations of them, I think
*nods* Definitely! Though you would have laughed if you could have seen how defensive my body language was during that conversation. It wasn't all bad though... And yeah, we talked about Jamie's comments (and Lee) too. She hadn't seen his interviews but agrees that it's worrying if there's some kind of rift between him and TPTB.

Fry and Laurie spark off each other so well. And Laurie plays harebrained very well.
brokenmnemonicbrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 12:42 pm (UTC)
Now I'm doubly curious... what did Kat make of Kara's stare in Rapture?

And Jamie needs people being defensive on his behalf for certain :)

I've been distracted from Jeeves and Wooster by early S1 Lee/Kara smut at Latte's urging... I've really missed happy pilot stuff ;)
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Lee thinking hmmbop_radar on June 16th, 2007 01:07 pm (UTC)
Ohh, I need to ask her about Rapture! Damn, I didn't. I'll do so on Wednesday. *resolves*

The short answer to what she made of Katee's comment was that she thought she was talking very much 'as Starbuck'. She said it made sense to her that Kara would think that her love for Anders was more mature. She says to Kara the relationship with Lee is confusing--it has several levels: the friendship level (which is safe and reassuring and desperately important to Kara) and then this tangled other thing (which makes Kara feel out of control and is full of all this insanely heightened emotion). Whereas her relationship with Anders is straightfoward, it doesn't make her feel out of control. And control = maturity in Kara's mind.

I then made a few points about how the relationship with Sam doesn't seem very mature to me at all. She kept saying that yes, that was obvious to someone with an outside objective perspective but to Kara, her feeling in the relationship is that it's more mature (which seems to translate as 'on her terms', 'controllable', 'unthreatening'). She said that Kara's feelings for Lee don't feel mature to Kara at all because he triggers her fear of failure. She's not afraid with Sam, so that makes her feel as if in that relationship she's got 'over' that fear. Everything is so much more intense and risky with Lee. And she said that Kara probably thinks back on the Quadrangle stuff with Lee as just proving how misguided it was of her to pursue something with Lee. :-( Since it created a lot of pain and fear and anxiety for Kara--none of the things she thinks of as 'mature'. Or even as 'love'. Which brings me to Cat's next point...

I pressed the issue about Katee stating it as Kara loving Sam MORE than Lee (rather than just reflecting on the relative health of the relationships). I think my exact words were 'but how can she interpret that as loving Sam MORE if in fact it's with Lee that things are so much more intense?' It was amazing how unsurprised Cat was by Katee saying this. She said it made sense from Kara perspective, because of Kara's coping mechanism of denial. She says Kara's scared to interpret what she feels with Lee as love because it's such a huge huge risk and she doesn't want love to be that frightening and uncontrollable. She kept coming back to Kara's control issues...

I also brought up Kara confiding in Anders about her mother. She said that was because Sam never ever pressed her. He'd created this safe zone where she could say something about an emotional issue without fear that he would make a big deal of it. If she said anything to Lee he'd take it so seriously, press her for more, or react with his own emotions on the subject--all of which is too much for Kara to deal with. Although she also said that she could imagine Kara giving Lee hints into her true emotional inner world under 'safe' circumstances (e.g. when they were drunk and it 'didn't matter' or Lee was too sloshed to pick up on the true signifcance of what she was telling him). She seemed to think Kara did at some level want to confide in Lee, and also that at some level, Kara does appreciate Lee's intensity, but that it frightens her. Kara tells herself Sam is better, healthier, more mature because it's the less confronting path. (But also--this is my interpretation--the path that won't lead her to any true resolution of the issues.)

Oh, and she also said Kara doesn't see the lack of give and take in the relationship with Sam as a problem. *bites tongue*

I've been distracted from Jeeves and Wooster by early S1 Lee/Kara smut at Latte's urging... I've really missed happy pilot stuff
Oh, lovely! What a very good idea. Happy pilots were/are wonderful.
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Lee maudlinbop_radar on June 16th, 2007 12:44 pm (UTC)
Oh, and I forgot! I have a special request for an icon. Would you be able to make one of besuited Lee (perhaps looking broken and shell-shocked after/during his speech in Crossroads) with the caption 'Intellectual kamikaze' on it? It's a term that c_mantix coined in conversation with me on the subject of Lee and other characters--I would love it and I think she'd get a big kick out of it too. I can hunt out a specific cap tomorrow if you're willing.
brokenmnemonic: Democracybrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 12:49 pm (UTC)
I can do that :) I've only got standard tv copies of Crossroads (no HD caps for them yet)... are you thinking something like the look he has immediately after hearing Laura say she has cancer, or are you thinking specifically post his own speech?
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Lee/Kara boundbop_radar on June 16th, 2007 01:08 pm (UTC)
Oh, yes, that gutted look when Laura says she has cancer could work quite well. I'm also remembering the look he gives his father when he talks about their guilt. There's no real hurry--if the caps are too hard to deal with, it could wait for HD caps to become available. And thank you! I really appreciate it!
brokenmnemonicbrokenmnemonic on June 16th, 2007 02:04 pm (UTC)
I shall see what I can do :D
brokenmnemonic: Democracybrokenmnemonic on June 17th, 2007 09:35 pm (UTC)
This is my first stab at the icon. Is it along the right sort of lines, or do you want something showing more of Lee?

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket
K, Bop or Boppy--take your pick!: Kara/Lee plottingbop_radar on June 18th, 2007 03:52 am (UTC)
Oh, thank you! I like the shot of him you used--he looks appropriately harrowed. LOL. But yeah, I was sort of thinking more of Lee... it's tricky with the words being so long though I guess.